Comments on: Breaking the 200 Barrier http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/ by Matthew Morine Fri, 30 Jul 2010 22:40:29 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Matthew http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8792 Matthew Mon, 19 Jan 2009 23:36:28 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8792 Most of the people that I baptized in Waynesboro are still faithfully attending. This says more about the goodness of the church there than about me. We do not believe in the get them wet evangelism. In Castle Rock one of the ministers does a lot of follow up study with every family that is reached too. Most of the people that I baptized in Waynesboro are still faithfully attending. This says more about the goodness of the church there than about me. We do not believe in the get them wet evangelism. In Castle Rock one of the ministers does a lot of follow up study with every family that is reached too.

]]> By: Joe Baggett http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8790 Joe Baggett Mon, 19 Jan 2009 22:49:29 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8790 That is good Matthew. It will be interesting to see how many of those new converts really become disciples and are still attending or growing spiritually in a few years. Remember the great commission is make disciples not just drag as many as possible to the baptistery. We recently did two studies of new converts one was with the Crusade in Dallas which was wrote up in the Christian Chronicle that claimed 400 baptisms another was with a church in central Texas that claimed 350 baptism of new converts in two years. In a nut shell only 15-20% were still attending a church with "church of Christ" on the sign outside the building after three years. 5% left the churches of Christ for other churches. Out the 15-20%who were still attending only a few about half (50%) could really point to significant on going personal transformation. So I would suggest that in your retreat you not only talk about conversions but making disciples. By disciples I mean transformed people that are being spiritually transformed constantly. We also learned that the conversions were predominantly white middle class so they did not proportionately represent the diverse culture in which we find ourselves. When the church is disproportioned to the surrounding demographics the Gospel becomes more for one type of people and less for others. It is also counterintuitive to the Gospel that is for “ALL” people. So I hope your retreat considers more than just dragging people to the baptistery and getting more members. There are a lot of church buildings standing empty because that baptized many but made few disciples. Some issues besides the conversions is the mass exodus of young people from organized religion and the absence of all the people who are remaining single well in to their forties. That is good Matthew. It will be interesting to see how many of those new converts really become disciples and are still attending or growing spiritually in a few years. Remember the great commission is make disciples not just drag as many as possible to the baptistery. We recently did two studies of new converts one was with the Crusade in Dallas which was wrote up in the Christian Chronicle that claimed 400 baptisms another was with a church in central Texas that claimed 350 baptism of new converts in two years. In a nut shell only 15-20% were still attending a church with “church of Christ” on the sign outside the building after three years. 5% left the churches of Christ for other churches. Out the 15-20%who were still attending only a few about half (50%) could really point to significant on going personal transformation. So I would suggest that in your retreat you not only talk about conversions but making disciples. By disciples I mean transformed people that are being spiritually transformed constantly. We also learned that the conversions were predominantly white middle class so they did not proportionately represent the diverse culture in which we find ourselves. When the church is disproportioned to the surrounding demographics the Gospel becomes more for one type of people and less for others. It is also counterintuitive to the Gospel that is for “ALL” people. So I hope your retreat considers more than just dragging people to the baptistery and getting more members. There are a lot of church buildings standing empty because that baptized many but made few disciples. Some issues besides the conversions is the mass exodus of young people from organized religion and the absence of all the people who are remaining single well in to their forties.

]]> By: Matthew http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8787 Matthew Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:22:14 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8787 Joe, We grew in Waynesboro the old fashion way through converrsions. If you knew Waynesboro you do not get move in growth, just move out decline but we beat it by converting people. We focued on spiritual growth and not how to grow the church. Joe,
We grew in Waynesboro the old fashion way through converrsions. If you knew Waynesboro you do not get move in growth, just move out decline but we beat it by converting people. We focued on spiritual growth and not how to grow the church.

]]> By: Joe Baggett http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8785 Joe Baggett Mon, 19 Jan 2009 19:14:35 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8785 Matthew, Just some questions that might help you in your retreat. The increase at Waynesboro from 160-190 net 30. Was it due to brand new disciples coming from lost and uncharted backgrounds and if so did the 30 new disciples represent the demographics surrounding the building like race, age, socio-economic groups etcetera. Instead of planning for numerical increase in attendance maybe you and the leadership group should consider how to “Spiritually Prepare” yourselves and the congregation. By spiritual preparation I mean how to engage the emerging post modern culture in spiritual dialogue (Answering their theological questions), how to make significant friendships with people who not typical white middle class church goers, Overcoming Legalism and creating a grace centered culture in the church, creating a come as you are culture in the church. Before you do this weekend I would recommend you read the book “Creating a come as you are culture in the church” by John Burke. It has a lot of questions that would be good for your retreat here is a sample of some of the questions. The opening question is this. What do a gay rights activist, a Buddhist monk, a twenty something single mom, a high tech engineer have in common? They are the future church in America! He illustrates that the demographics in Americas have been changing drastically and quickly and not in favor of the traditional church so new converts will come from our post modern culture that is very skeptical of organized religion. http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?r=1&ISBN=9780310275015&ourl=No%2DPerfect%2DPeople%2DAllowed%2FJohn%2DBurke Table of Contents Contents Introduction: God's Story in Our Stories 9 Part One: The Struggle for Emerging Generations 1 The First Corinthian Church of America 15 2 Cynical and Jaded: Results of the Postmodern Experiment 29 Part Two: The Struggle with Trust 3 Doubters Wanted: Creating a Culture of Dialogue 51 4 Losing My Need to Pretend: Creating a Culture of Authenticity 69 Part Three: The Struggle with Tolerance 5 Come as You Are: Creating a Culture of Acceptance 87 6 But Don't Stay That Way: Creating a Culture of Growth 105 7 What about Other Religions? The Tolerance Litmus Test--Q1 125 8 How Do You Feel about Gays? The Tolerance Litmus Test--Q2 147 Part Four: The Struggle with Truth 9 The Humble Truth about Truth: Creating a Culture of Truth-Telling Humility 167 10 Tribal Truth: Creating the Culture of Incarnational Truth 185 Part Five: The Struggle with Brokenness 11 All God Intended You to Be: Creating a Culture of Hope 205 12 Mental Monogamy: Creating a Culture of Sexual Wholeness 223 13 Recovering an Addicted Generation: Creating a Culture of Healing 243 Part Six: The Struggle with Aloneness 14 Nobody Stands Alone: Creating a Culture of Connection 267 15 The Family I Never Had: Creating a Culture of Family 285 Part Seven: The Struggle Forward 16 Life or Death? Creating a Culture for Emerging Leaders 303 Matthew,
Just some questions that might help you in your retreat. The increase at Waynesboro from 160-190 net 30. Was it due to brand new disciples coming from lost and uncharted backgrounds and if so did the 30 new disciples represent the demographics surrounding the building like race, age, socio-economic groups etcetera. Instead of planning for numerical increase in attendance maybe you and the leadership group should consider how to “Spiritually Prepare” yourselves and the congregation. By spiritual preparation I mean how to engage the emerging post modern culture in spiritual dialogue (Answering their theological questions), how to make significant friendships with people who not typical white middle class church goers, Overcoming Legalism and creating a grace centered culture in the church, creating a come as you are culture in the church. Before you do this weekend I would recommend you read the book “Creating a come as you are culture in the church” by John Burke. It has a lot of questions that would be good for your retreat here is a sample of some of the questions. The opening question is this. What do a gay rights activist, a Buddhist monk, a twenty something single mom, a high tech engineer have in common? They are the future church in America! He illustrates that the demographics in Americas have been changing drastically and quickly and not in favor of the traditional church so new converts will come from our post modern culture that is very skeptical of organized religion.
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?r=1&ISBN=9780310275015&ourl=No%2DPerfect%2DPeople%2DAllowed%2FJohn%2DBurke
Table of Contents
Contents
Introduction: God’s Story in Our Stories 9
Part One: The Struggle for Emerging Generations
1 The First Corinthian Church of America 15
2 Cynical and Jaded: Results of the Postmodern Experiment 29
Part Two: The Struggle with Trust
3 Doubters Wanted: Creating a Culture of Dialogue 51
4 Losing My Need to Pretend: Creating a Culture of Authenticity 69
Part Three: The Struggle with Tolerance
5 Come as You Are: Creating a Culture of Acceptance 87
6 But Don’t Stay That Way: Creating a Culture of Growth 105
7 What about Other Religions? The Tolerance Litmus Test–Q1 125
8 How Do You Feel about Gays? The Tolerance Litmus Test–Q2 147
Part Four: The Struggle with Truth
9 The Humble Truth about Truth: Creating a Culture of Truth-Telling
Humility 167
10 Tribal Truth: Creating the Culture of Incarnational Truth 185
Part Five: The Struggle with Brokenness
11 All God Intended You to Be: Creating a Culture of Hope 205
12 Mental Monogamy: Creating a Culture of Sexual Wholeness 223
13 Recovering an Addicted Generation: Creating a Culture of Healing 243
Part Six: The Struggle with Aloneness
14 Nobody Stands Alone: Creating a Culture of Connection 267
15 The Family I Never Had: Creating a Culture of Family 285
Part Seven: The Struggle Forward
16 Life or Death? Creating a Culture for Emerging Leaders 303

]]> By: Mitchell Skelton http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8713 Mitchell Skelton Fri, 16 Jan 2009 05:16:03 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8713 Castle Rock will experience explosive growth if you can "sell" the congregation on the "every member is a minister" philosophy. You have the base of a large community and you have the support of a caring, determined, Spirit-led eldership; establish the ministries, identify the leaders and get out of the way! Castle Rock will experience explosive growth if you can “sell” the congregation on the “every member is a minister” philosophy. You have the base of a large community and you have the support of a caring, determined, Spirit-led eldership; establish the ministries, identify the leaders and get out of the way!

]]> By: Mitchell Skelton http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8712 Mitchell Skelton Fri, 16 Jan 2009 05:08:03 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8712 Matthew, Thanks for the kind comments, I truly believe that we had a synergy that worked well together. My belief is that the focus needs to be on ministries. Ministries are servant led, meaning that people involved in the ministries are growing spiritually and they are in the field sowing seed. Basically, That's all we can do, we sow the seed and God makes it grow. Seed can be sown in many ways; feeding the hungry, caring for the sick, counseling the hurting, playing dodgeball with kids in an after school ministry, and the list goes on. In ministry led congregations the community begins to learn the congregation as God intended, they meet Christians, not programs or facilities. The lost are saved through relationships, obviously it requires a relationship with Christ but that most often evolves out of a relationship with one of Christ's followers. Matthew,

Thanks for the kind comments, I truly believe that we had a synergy that worked well together.

My belief is that the focus needs to be on ministries. Ministries are servant led, meaning that people involved in the ministries are growing spiritually and they are in the field sowing seed. Basically, That’s all we can do, we sow the seed and God makes it grow. Seed can be sown in many ways; feeding the hungry, caring for the sick, counseling the hurting, playing dodgeball with kids in an after school ministry, and the list goes on.

In ministry led congregations the community begins to learn the congregation as God intended, they meet Christians, not programs or facilities. The lost are saved through relationships, obviously it requires a relationship with Christ but that most often evolves out of a relationship with one of Christ’s followers.

]]> By: Matthew http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8703 Matthew Fri, 16 Jan 2009 00:16:33 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8703 I love the application you gave to Acts 1:8. Great stuff. I love the application you gave to Acts 1:8. Great stuff.

]]> By: Jim Sexton http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8702 Jim Sexton Fri, 16 Jan 2009 00:04:27 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8702 Acts 1:8 "... and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem (across the street), Judea (across the state) and in all Judea (across the nation) and Samaria (where you don't want to go) and to the end of the earth (anywhere and everywhere). We don't see the mission in our own backyard, in our own state, or in our own nation... which has a lot to do with why those 3 places are in such dire need of the Gospel. Throw in the places that we don't want to personally go to and that leaves you with sending your money to support others at the end of the earth. Can't get your hands very dirty writing a check to those across the globe. Working with those across the street/town/state/nation is a little bit scary because we then must take a personal stake in the work, teaching, reaching, healing, forgiving, etc... those who are right here in from of us. Jimbo Acts 1:8 “… and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem (across the street), Judea (across the state) and in all Judea (across the nation) and Samaria (where you don’t want to go) and to the end of the earth (anywhere and everywhere).

We don’t see the mission in our own backyard, in our own state, or in our own nation… which has a lot to do with why those 3 places are in such dire need of the Gospel. Throw in the places that we don’t want to personally go to and that leaves you with sending your money to support others at the end of the earth.

Can’t get your hands very dirty writing a check to those across the globe. Working with those across the street/town/state/nation is a little bit scary because we then must take a personal stake in the work, teaching, reaching, healing, forgiving, etc… those who are right here in from of us.

Jimbo

]]> By: K. Rex Butts http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8698 K. Rex Butts Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:43:03 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8698 Matthew, One thing that planting churches does is help instill in the church ethos the idea of mission. I am more and more convinced that for many Christians in N. America, "mission" is something only for accross seas. I don't know how we arrived at that thinking but we surely did not get it from reading the Bible. -Rex Matthew,

One thing that planting churches does is help instill in the church ethos the idea of mission. I am more and more convinced that for many Christians in N. America, “mission” is something only for accross seas. I don’t know how we arrived at that thinking but we surely did not get it from reading the Bible.

-Rex

]]> By: Matthew http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/breaking-the-200-barrier/723/comment-page-1/#comment-8696 Matthew Thu, 15 Jan 2009 20:26:34 +0000 http://www.matthewmorine.com/?p=723#comment-8696 Dale I love those 6 "o". You to publish them because are so helpful for congregational. I am going preach them in castle rock. Rex, a friend of mine beleives that planning to plant a church will help the church continue to grow. Dale I love those 6 “o”. You to publish them because are so helpful for congregational. I am going preach them in castle rock. Rex, a friend of mine beleives that planning to plant a church will help the church continue to grow.

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