Comments on: Evangelism of the Converted by the Converted http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/ by Matthew Morine Sat, 04 Feb 2012 04:16:46 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Joe Baggett http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6381 Joe Baggett Fri, 03 Oct 2008 14:53:12 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6381 As a percentage the USA has more but at a total real number of unchurched the USA is the largest. As a percentage the USA has more but at a total real number of unchurched the USA is the largest.

]]> By: Rex http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6360 Rex Thu, 02 Oct 2008 14:35:54 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6360 Eddy, I love your illustrations, especially the planting seed vs. gluing apples to trees. -Rex Eddy,

I love your illustrations, especially the planting seed vs. gluing apples to trees.

-Rex

]]> By: eddy http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6359 eddy Thu, 02 Oct 2008 14:11:22 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6359 Since scripture does not speak of early church "restoring Christianity", does it not sound goofy to say that I am scripturally doing church work by "restoring Christianity"? If I want to restore/plant the game of football in a non-footballed place, methinks the starting point is not with uniforms and team mascots--if I throw a football to enuf folks, a game will happen and somewhere down the line uniforms and mascots will happen. Otherwise, I've not planted football but rather, uniforms. (Kinda like the parent who thinks they've taught a kid to clean house when they only taught the kid to yell at a dirty house.) Planting seed is nothing like trying to glue an apple to a dead branch. Since scripture does not speak of early church “restoring Christianity”, does it not sound goofy to say that I am scripturally doing church work by “restoring Christianity”? If I want to restore/plant the game of football in a non-footballed place, methinks the starting point is not with uniforms and team mascots–if I throw a football to enuf folks, a game will happen and somewhere down the line uniforms and mascots will happen. Otherwise, I’ve not planted football but rather, uniforms. (Kinda like the parent who thinks they’ve taught a kid to clean house when they only taught the kid to yell at a dirty house.) Planting seed is nothing like trying to glue an apple to a dead branch.

]]> By: Paula Harrington http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6358 Paula Harrington Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:01:09 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6358 As aways, you did a wonderful job with this post. As aways, you did a wonderful job with this post.

]]> By: Eric S. Mueller http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6357 Eric S. Mueller Thu, 02 Oct 2008 11:13:54 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6357 I agree. My church has that same "What to expect" pamphlet in our Welcome Packet. The "New Testament Christianity" does seem to be a phrase set up to be contentious. It's like saying "We seek to restore the 4 wheeled car". Is there any other kind? One thing that is bugging me about churches lately (this isn't specific to churches of Christ as it happened to me visiting a Baptist church last night) is that when visitors are present in a Bible class, the teacher always assumes that everybody is unsaved and dumbs the lesson down to the message of the cross and salvation. Obviously, this is a glorious message, but to be honest, it feels like perpetually auditing a Kindergarten class. With 66 books in the Bible and Jesus Christ on every page, why can't classes, even with unsaved visitors present (especially with visitors are are Christians but are assumed not to be until after the class when they can be talked to) cover other topics? When I'm teaching a class, and I have visitors, I just continue with my material. Even if I have a visitor who has NEVER set foot in a church and knows nothing more about Christianity than what he read in a "New Atheist" book, hopefully I can throw out something intellectually challenging enough to make the person interested in hearing more. I agree. My church has that same “What to expect” pamphlet in our Welcome Packet. The “New Testament Christianity” does seem to be a phrase set up to be contentious. It’s like saying “We seek to restore the 4 wheeled car”. Is there any other kind?

One thing that is bugging me about churches lately (this isn’t specific to churches of Christ as it happened to me visiting a Baptist church last night) is that when visitors are present in a Bible class, the teacher always assumes that everybody is unsaved and dumbs the lesson down to the message of the cross and salvation. Obviously, this is a glorious message, but to be honest, it feels like perpetually auditing a Kindergarten class. With 66 books in the Bible and Jesus Christ on every page, why can’t classes, even with unsaved visitors present (especially with visitors are are Christians but are assumed not to be until after the class when they can be talked to) cover other topics? When I’m teaching a class, and I have visitors, I just continue with my material. Even if I have a visitor who has NEVER set foot in a church and knows nothing more about Christianity than what he read in a “New Atheist” book, hopefully I can throw out something intellectually challenging enough to make the person interested in hearing more.

]]> By: Rex http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6355 Rex Thu, 02 Oct 2008 03:27:44 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6355 Though the USA has more regular church attendees, the reseach that I have read suggests that church attendance is in rapid decline and that the USA is only 30-40 years behind Australia and Western Europe in terms of a post-Christian culture. When I lived in Ithaca, the culture was dominated by a thoroughly pagan college named Cornell University. One of the coffee shops that I frequented had a picture of Jesus and the Devil hugging each other behind a pulpit saying "we've collaborated for the good of society. Ithaca was a culture that was religiously indifferent because any religous belief was acceptable so long as it was a privitized belief. However, the culture of Ithaca was a political powderkeg filled with conservative and liberal capitolists, socialist, communists, and many other political viewpoints. This is one reason why I want to pull my hair out everytime I hear Christians who sound more passionate for Republican and Democrat ideologies than the kingdom of God -- politics will not redeem the world, Jesus Christ, who preached the good news of the Kingdom, will. Also, Ithaca is where I met the first person who was raised in the USA and had never heard of the Bible (the person was an 18-year old college student from Conneticut). So any ways, that is one example of how the USA culture has become/is becoming a post-Christian culture. My suggestion is that Christians need to get out of the business of American politics, redicover what it means to live the life of Jesus Christ, and preach the good news of Jesus and the Kingdom (people will begin to believe the truth if they see it embodied in the local churches and Christians they encounter). Some of us are already striving to do this but we must teach the rest (many?) of the Christians we have influence over to learn how to be disciples once again, for it seems that their is a wide gulf between being a "Christian" and being a disciple (and this includes the CoC). If you want a good read at what true discipleship means let me suggest first that we re-read all four of the Gospels. As for books... the classic of course is Dietrich Bonhoeffer, "The Cost of Discipleship" but a more recent well-written book is Lee C. Camp, "Mere Discipleship: Radical Christianity in a Rebellious World" (Lee Camp is a Professor at Lipscomb University). Good conversation! -Rex Though the USA has more regular church attendees, the reseach that I have read suggests that church attendance is in rapid decline and that the USA is only 30-40 years behind Australia and Western Europe in terms of a post-Christian culture. When I lived in Ithaca, the culture was dominated by a thoroughly pagan college named Cornell University. One of the coffee shops that I frequented had a picture of Jesus and the Devil hugging each other behind a pulpit saying “we’ve collaborated for the good of society. Ithaca was a culture that was religiously indifferent because any religous belief was acceptable so long as it was a privitized belief. However, the culture of Ithaca was a political powderkeg filled with conservative and liberal capitolists, socialist, communists, and many other political viewpoints. This is one reason why I want to pull my hair out everytime I hear Christians who sound more passionate for Republican and Democrat ideologies than the kingdom of God — politics will not redeem the world, Jesus Christ, who preached the good news of the Kingdom, will. Also, Ithaca is where I met the first person who was raised in the USA and had never heard of the Bible (the person was an 18-year old college student from Conneticut). So any ways, that is one example of how the USA culture has become/is becoming a post-Christian culture.

My suggestion is that Christians need to get out of the business of American politics, redicover what it means to live the life of Jesus Christ, and preach the good news of Jesus and the Kingdom (people will begin to believe the truth if they see it embodied in the local churches and Christians they encounter). Some of us are already striving to do this but we must teach the rest (many?) of the Christians we have influence over to learn how to be disciples once again, for it seems that their is a wide gulf between being a “Christian” and being a disciple (and this includes the CoC).
If you want a good read at what true discipleship means let me suggest first that we re-read all four of the Gospels. As for books… the classic of course is Dietrich Bonhoeffer, “The Cost of Discipleship” but a more recent well-written book is Lee C. Camp, “Mere Discipleship: Radical Christianity in a Rebellious World” (Lee Camp is a Professor at Lipscomb University).

Good conversation!

-Rex

]]> By: Wendy http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6354 Wendy Thu, 02 Oct 2008 02:27:45 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6354 Preach it, Matthew. Great comments, Rex. Joe, I would have thought the UK or Australia were more unchurched than the USA. Only about 12% of the Aus population attends church regularly. OK, I reread and saw that the USA has the largest number of unchurched in the developed world. Preach it, Matthew. Great comments, Rex. Joe, I would have thought the UK or Australia were more unchurched than the USA. Only about 12% of the Aus population attends church regularly. OK, I reread and saw that the USA has the largest number of unchurched in the developed world.

]]> By: Zack Blaisdell http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6350 Zack Blaisdell Thu, 02 Oct 2008 00:02:21 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6350 Well said Matthew. We in the churches of Christ seem to have our own language which goes right over everyone else's heads. I agree that we need to communicate better with the outsider in mind. That is one of the things I like about 7 Practices of Effective Ministry. The authors said something similar to what you said here. Well done! God bless. Grace and Peace. Well said Matthew. We in the churches of Christ seem to have our own language which goes right over everyone else’s heads. I agree that we need to communicate better with the outsider in mind. That is one of the things I like about 7 Practices of Effective Ministry. The authors said something similar to what you said here. Well done! God bless. Grace and Peace.

]]> By: Terry http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6347 Terry Wed, 01 Oct 2008 22:09:30 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6347 It's interesting that I have been able to connect with a number of evangelicals through my blog without making an effort to do so. (I have also connected with a few people from Churches of Christ.) It has been a pleasure to get to know you a little through your blog. I hope that you will continue blogging when you move. It’s interesting that I have been able to connect with a number of evangelicals through my blog without making an effort to do so. (I have also connected with a few people from Churches of Christ.) It has been a pleasure to get to know you a little through your blog. I hope that you will continue blogging when you move.

]]> By: Matthew http://www.matthewmorine.com/church-news/evangelism-of-the-converted-by-the-converted/646/comment-page-1/#comment-6346 Matthew Wed, 01 Oct 2008 22:05:38 +0000 http://matthewsblog.waynesborochurchofchrist.org/?p=646#comment-6346 By the way, it was not first street church of christ, just wanting to not call names. But hopefully most people realized that with the name first street. By the way, it was not first street church of christ, just wanting to not call names. But hopefully most people realized that with the name first street.

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